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Guilty Gear and/or BlazBlue.


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#1 Lenin

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Posted 11 February 2010 - 03:06 AM

Discuss the only fighting games on the market that don't suck balls... Well, the first BlazBlue game was awful, but the sequel looks promising.

Anyway. I'm an A.B.A. main in Guilty Gear, and I play Venom off and on... Used to main Dizzy, but not so much anymore. I'm a shithead who only recently discovered he is a Testament player. As for BlazBlue, I'm a strict Hakumen player.

Edited by Lenin, 01 June 2010 - 04:37 AM.

you look like a man who takes himself seriously...


#2 Neko Arc Chaos

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Posted 11 February 2010 - 01:56 PM

guilty gear, but street fighter is a better game in terms of timing mechanics.
*Snipped (Your Penis Has Been Cut~Godzilla)*

#3 Lenin

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 12:37 AM

Lenin from 2008 said:

Oh, you play Street Fighter? What's your favorite move to spam? Hadouken? Tiger shots? Scissor kicks? Messiah kick? The world is your oyster, and that oyster tastes like spam.

All Street Fighter has is it's timing mechanics. Timing your endless fireballs, timing your DP (LOL NOT ANYMORE, THANK YOU POORLY IMPLEMENTED SHORTCUT SYSTEM), timing your whatever-else, learning the UNLIMITED one-frame-links that are in those games because of Capcom getting it in their heads that difficulty is the exact same thing as depth (KoF has this same problem). You don't really play that game at a certain point as much as you simply exploit it's lame-ass engine.

Edited by Lenin, 12 February 2010 - 12:38 AM.

you look like a man who takes himself seriously...


#4 LCC

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 02:11 AM

You can always play 3S, A3, CvS2, and MvC2 if you don't like heavy projectile use and get more flexibility. Cable is obviously an exception haha. ST and SF4 are the big spam fireballs and punish jumpins all day games. They're still good games though on balance alone.

GG is fun but at high levels you get pressure blockstrings that last forever because of everything being bufferable and combos that last 20 seconds and take away over half your life. The cast diversity is pretty amazing, however.
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#5 Griffon

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 05:35 AM

I'll admit, I do have a lot of fun with Street Fighter, and am eagerly awaiting SSF4 much more than the new BlazBlue game.
However, Guilty Gear thoroughly beats them both. You know why? I'll tell you why.

Faust.

Armored Core has changed.

It's no longer about recreation, originality or ability. It's an endless series of xeroxed metabuilds, made by copycats and sheep. Armored Core, and its consumption of time, has become a hackneyed ruse. Armored Core has changed. Unoriginal players pilot unoriginal ACs, use unoriginal setups. Overpowered weapons on their mech atrophy and degenerate their abilities. Design copying. Weapon copying. Player copying. Tactic copying. Everything is observed, and then copied. Armored Core has changed.


#6 †Adonael

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 01:58 PM

Guilty Gear XX #RELOADED on my PC. SoulBadGuy and sometimes the samurai chick.


I also like Tekken. So sue me.
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#7 Lenin

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 09:53 PM

 LCC, on Feb 12 2010, 02:11 AM, said:

You can always play 3S, A3, CvS2, and MvC2 if you don't like heavy projectile use and get more flexibility. Cable is obviously an exception haha. ST and SF4 are the big spam fireballs and punish jumpins all day games. They're still good games though on balance alone.

3S (Ibuki and Q FTW. Fuck everybody else) and MvC2 (Magneto, Storm, Sentinel vs. Magneto, Storm, Sentinel - Needs moar Ibuki and Q) are fairly okay. The balance is pathetic, though. Outside of 3S, the only almost good SF game on the market is HD Remix because just like 3S, you don't dominate with endless fireballs (LOL IN 3S YOU DOMINATE THROUGH BULLSHIT JUGGLES). 3S can almost be forgiven for it's absolutely retarded balance issues of having only three tiers (broken, almost broken and damn near useless), because of the parry system. But I resent the fact you have to be a goddamn mind-reader to have any sort of success with the not-broken characters.

If you want to talk about balance, then obviously I'll refer you to GG. Aside from the lead-paint-eating Accent Core iteration with Eddie and Testament (Slayer too, if you want to go down that road... but he's not as bad) seeing levels of Godliness that rendered cleanliness unnecessary, the games have been more balanced than Street Fighter ever was. And because I feel like I'm just piling onto SF, I'll say that BlazBlue: Calamity Trigger was a ridiculously unbalanced shitpile of endless fail. Carl vs Tager, 9.5-.5 in Carl's favor. I wish that game was a person so I could shoot it in the fucking face.

 LCC, on Feb 12 2010, 02:11 AM, said:

GG is fun but at high levels you get pressure blockstrings that last forever because of everything being bufferable and combos that last 20 seconds and take away over half your life.

The pressure you're refering to is only really accessible to a few characters (Eddie/Mr. Cornerrape, Dizzy, Venom, et cetera) and requires a very high level of exeuction. Even the top players fuck it up occasionally. Ignoring Eddie's free unblockables, Venom is the worst to get cornered by, because his pressure never has to end, if you have the skill and if you're not N-Otoko, you don't. But that's your reward for learning the most mindfuckingly complicated character in any fighting game (I think some people would dispute this and cite K9999... What the fuck is SNK trying to prove? But it's really not the same thing).

As for the combos, if you get hit into one of those twenty-second-50%-damage-combos, it's a culmination of your own fuck up and your opponent peacocking in the fight. Just because there's probably a shorter option that does essentially the same damage. The more you play the game, the less it phases you since you learn appropriate retaliation and how to prevent it.

Edited by Lenin, 13 February 2010 - 04:39 PM.

you look like a man who takes himself seriously...


#8 Exile

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 08:52 PM

I still play Accent Core sometimes, normally use Testament and Dizzy, mess around with Zappa some. The game is fucking murder sometimes

#9 Harakiri Tiger

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 08:58 PM

 Lenin, on Feb 12 2010, 09:53 PM, said:

The more you play the game, the less it phases you since you learn appropriate retaliation and how to prevent it.

This can be said of very many fighting games, haha.

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a female in her crotch until he feels satisfied.


#10 LCC

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 02:51 AM

That can be said of all games since the dawn of time.
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#11 Brit

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 11:25 AM

This is why I don't play Blazblue anymore: Hakumen is the dopest character in the game, and he sucks. This is not to be confused with “Brit, you just suck with him” anger. I've beaten MUCH better Hakumen players, and I've beaten one of the top Nu players worldwide, WITH Hakumen. That doesn't change the fact that Hakumen is bad bad bad.

Well, that and the game is terribly imbalanced in general.

I greatly prefer Street Fighter 3 and 4 mainly because I like knowing that my opponent can see exactly why they're losing. They can see what mistake is being made, what impact it has, how I'm capitalizing on it and what mistakes I'm making at the same time.

You can't get that from GG and BB. Mainly because the reason you're losing is because the other person has a better rushdown or a better turtle game. There's no in between.

And as far as spamming moves goes, I mean, you expect me to NOT get free damage while you keep walking into my Scissors Kick? You honestly think I'm going to stop doing what I KNOW is working because it bothers you? That's like you asking me to not use 214B xx 623a,a -> 9C -> 663C over and over again. Grow up and get over it. Or even better, get around it.

#12 Lenin

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 08:34 PM

 Brit, on Feb 15 2010, 11:25 AM, said:

You can't get that from GG and BB. Mainly because the reason you're losing is because the other person has a better rushdown or a better turtle game. There's no in between.

There is no turtling in GG/BB. If someone is turtling, they obviously don't care about their meter. If they don't care about their meter, they should be getting destroyed because they obviously don't know what they're doing. And yes, you do know exactly why you're losing in GG. You're losing because the other person is a better player than you (or you're playing Johnny in Accent Core, fuck that game is stupid).

And we know all the reasons people lose at BlazBlue.

 Brit, on Feb 15 2010, 11:25 AM, said:

And as far as spamming moves goes, I mean, you expect me to NOT get free damage while you keep walking into my Scissors Kick? You honestly think I'm going to stop doing what I KNOW is working because it bothers you? That's like you asking me to not use 214B xx 623a,a -> 9C -> 663C over and over again. Grow up and get over it. Or even better, get around it.

Never said I had a problem getting around it. I dislike the fact that Street Fighter ecourages you doing the same fucking thing over and over and over and over again. FIREBALL FIREBALL FIREBALL FIREBALL FIREBALL and SCISSOR KICK SCISSOR KICK NOW U R IN THE CORNER HAVE SOME SCISSOR KICK TRAP SCISSOR KICK TRAP SCISSOR KICK TRAP are viable strategies is disgusting. The fact I can competently play Street Fighter at six in the morning when I'm trashed out of my skull should tell everybody something.

 LCC, on Feb 14 2010, 02:51 AM, said:

That can be said of all games since the dawn of time.

Exactly. It's just harder with GG/BB because they have the learning curve of a fighter jet. It's not overnight.

Edited by Lenin, 16 February 2010 - 08:41 PM.

you look like a man who takes himself seriously...


#13 Brit

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 10:24 PM

You're kidding right? What you're telling me is that Arakune/Rachel/Nu can't turtle?

I haven't ever seen Spiderman move forward EVER, except for one time when some beat Arakune player got me corner guard trapped and kept crushing my guard with BEEEEEES.
I've seen Rachel players just hang back throwing shit out when you try to get in and just wait for NegPen to show up before moving forward, get in a quick combo and back out again.
Nu will LOSE if she comes to you because if she gets too close, that puts her too close inside 5D range. It whiffs. Why would she move forward?

You tell me this game has no turtling, when the TOP 3 CHARACTERS can turtle it out better than Dhalsim...

I... I don't see it.

*Edit: The only fighting games I can straight up say there is no turtling in would be Smash and anything from SNK.

Edited by Brit, 16 February 2010 - 10:28 PM.


#14 Lenin

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 11:31 PM

Apparently I have my own dictionary for fighting game slang:

Turtling (sl.), verb: lacking the testicular awesomeness required to fight; running away and accomplishing nothing. Destined for fail. See the Soul Calibur metagame prior to the conception of the Soul Guage/Critical Finish/custom Cassandra-style male characters teabagging you FTW.

Zoning (sl.), verb: successfully keeping your opponent where you want them via ranged attacks. Destined for fail. Unless you're Nu. (Until BB:CT, Arc actually did everything possible to discourage this)

They sound similar on paper, but the difference is like heaven and Earth in practice. There's a big difference between what CT Nu and Dhalsim do in comparison to what say, Bison gets forced into against Zangief.

Edited by Lenin, 16 February 2010 - 11:35 PM.

you look like a man who takes himself seriously...


#15 Harakiri Tiger

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 11:35 PM

I zone with Guile a lot, werd.

Sex
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a female in her crotch until he feels satisfied.


#16 Lenin

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 12:28 AM

Amurrrrrrrica, fuck yeah.

you look like a man who takes himself seriously...


#17 TemjinZero

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 01:40 AM

Have you guys been reading up on BB:CS?

New characters for console version:
Tsubaki
Hazama
mu-12 (;) :P :P)

Btw Brit, Hakumen gets a new C attack in BB:CS that seems to have a good amount of range and launches fast. ;)

Plus most if not all C attacks are chargeable, and when hit by a charged C, causes stun. ;)

Oh, and now I think counter wonrks on projectiles and summons a black hole of sorts. ;)




Edited by TemjinZero, 17 February 2010 - 01:46 AM.


#18 Lenin

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 03:46 AM

Incredibly, unbelievably, ridiculously, amazingly old/10. Haha. Maybe I've just been following CS updates like they're the Grateful Dead.

The new C attack is 4C. It can't be canceled out of, nor canceled into. It's just Litchi's 6B with projectile slashing ability. It's only upside is that it's really fuckin' fast. Outside of that, it's really just... there. Not that it really needs to do anything. I watched a CS Hakumen score a twelve hit combo on Litchi that was good for 85% of her health. I heard Hakumen can do damage in this game.

And the black-hole isn't off his drive, rather it's what happens now when he cuts a projectile. It lingers around for about three seconds, if a projectile hits it, the timer it's on restarts, and if your opponent touches it, (I think) you can combo them if they're close enough. It's a pretty solid thing to have against dumbass Nu, Arakune, Litchi, Hazama and Jin players, since you'll probably be getting it out a lot in those fights and if you get it on the ground, you can hide out in it to build meter, which is great because in CS, 'Mugen' is apparently the Japanese word for "LOL TK TSUBAKI LOOP".

Also, don't call her Mu/µ-12. Awful name (almost as bad as Lambda-11). Call her Hot Noel.

EDIT: That video description is SO fucking wrong. That is not how Hakumen is played. I don't care what the dickriders say, Kaqn's Hakumen is a shitpile. The guy should really stick to Ragna... With Hakumen, all he does is traffic in dropped combos. Also, what's his problem? Who RCs anything with Hakumen? All his stuff cancels into and out of other moves on their own and his recovery times are astonishingly low. You're wasting the meter you so desperately need to, Christ, I don't know... do anything? Not like it would've really helped him anyway. I just found it staggering in it's pointlessness.

Edited by Lenin, 17 February 2010 - 04:00 AM.

you look like a man who takes himself seriously...


#19 Lenin

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 05:41 PM

Ibuki and Q (shit, can't forget Hugo)'s awesomeness are the only real redeeming factors to 3S. MvC2 is awesome for funsies, but it's just too unbalanced to be a good competitive game. So is BB:CT (though I did see some curve balls with CT at SBO '09).

Back to Ibuki. Capcom screwed the pooch on this one - And Ibuki's new legs looked to Chun-Li, and said unto her: "Imitation is the most sincere form of flattery." Even though it's just the outfit, it sucks. Does this ninja garb make my thighs look like two holiday hams on 'roids? She better be dressed like a hooker in her alt. costume.

Edited by Lenin, 17 February 2010 - 05:47 PM.

you look like a man who takes himself seriously...


#20 TemjinZero

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Posted 17 February 2010 - 05:54 PM

But isn't that just because Ibuki wears baggy pants? It looks identical to how she looked in 3rd strike?





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