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Hip-hop


Genocide

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Yeah, if the producer is hiring people, then its like Ethos said, they had the say in what went into the album or songs those guys were asked to help make.

 

So much of the shit on TV, is just marketing. MTV is a marketing machine, they pump out ads in the programming and ads that are just ads. So glamorized that it just appeals to anyone watching (right? If you're retarded, perhaps). A lot of it is oriented at youth and young adults, kids want shit cuz they're immature and acting like babies. "Mom, give me this or you're a bad mom, and I'll be pissed off and do something CRAZY!" So, yeah, some people with an interest in the artist know this, like the producers (though more commonly the radio & record label execs), and some of it is just them getting pimped like a street-walking whore.

 

Music for the masses! Sometimes not the best thing to do, sell-outs I guess can be yelled at a bit, but pressures are put on them too you know.

 

Fuck all that thought though, why force someone to make something that adheres to a marketing campaign?

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It's already been answered, they can overlap. Hip-hop can encompass rap, as hip-hop is a broad category of music.

 

Also note that rapping is a verb for an actual way you spit your words out while hip-hop is just a name of a category of music. I have no problem either if people categorize 'rap' as hip-hop.

Edited by TMRaven
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I'm still convinced hip-hop and rap only translates well onto albums. The ones with live performances always come across as messy, the live bands I've been seeing hardly contribute anything to the constant indecipherable barrage of vocals by one or two boisterous guys tromping around on stage. I've got a question, has any live hip-hop/rap performance ever evoked any level of emotion from any of you? It seems the performances manifest into the lowest level of mental activity, just look at the guys rapping, their mouths are hanging open, blank looks on their faces, a complete failure to articulate words, also the the way they move around it looks as if they are bored or tired, nothing seems to be together, it's almost as if they really do not care. They do not care to deliver anything powerful or meaningful, they do not grasp the concept of emotional execution. Is that simply not the point of the music, if so what is? I can totally see why all the young kids pants are falling down if this is all that they listen to.
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So for Ethos.

 

Hip-Hop = Good

Rap = Bad Hip-Hop

 

No, more like:

 

Good hip-hop=Good

Bad hip-hop=Bad

 

or if you wanna break it down further:

 

most mainstream hip hop=bad

most "underground" hip hop=good

 

tho that's a big generalization.

 

To me, hip hop is the genre of music (if you wanna break it down to just music, cause originally, hip hop was the whole thing, the music, the graffiti, the breakdancing), and rap is the verb of what the guys are doing, i.e. they're rapping on the track haha.

 

 

EDIT: gotta answer Nomrah here:

 

 

I'm still convinced hip-hop and rap only translates well onto albums. The ones with live performances always come across as messy, the live bands I've been seeing hardly contribute anything to the constant indecipherable barrage of vocals by one or two boisterous guys tromping around on stage. I've got a question, has any live hip-hop/rap performance ever evoked any level of emotion from any of you? It seems the performances manifest into the lowest level of mental activity, just look at the guys rapping, their mouths are hanging open, blank looks on their faces, a complete failure to articulate words, also the the way they move around it looks as if they are bored or tired, nothing seems to be together, it's almost as if they really do not care. They do not care to deliver anything powerful or meaningful, they do not grasp the concept of emotional execution. Is that simply not the point of the music, if so what is? I can totally see why all the young kids pants are falling down if this is all that they listen to.

 

 

I've seen metal shows and rock shows where the live performances are messy too, so this is just not only to hip hop performances. I've also been seen some bands that have been unable to invoke any level of emotion out of me. I've seen some pretty shitty metal performances, usually waiting for the band I went to see to come on. Live performance and studio performance are two different things. If they suck at having a live presence, they aren't gonna give you a good show, and this goes for any music artist; not just hip hop. I'm sad to say that I haven't been to a hip hop show (partly cause I'm over going to shows as I hate going by myself and other fans tend to piss me off, specially when they're younger), but I'd imagine that not all hip hop artists give the same quality of live performance. I'd also imagine that if I went to a hip hop show to see a hip hop artist I like, I would be excited to hear the songs I like, I'd try to rap along, happy I'm hearing it live, and I'd feel something if I can relate to what they're saying in the song. You know, the same that I would do and feel if I was in another show instead.

 

In short though, all that you said can be said about every genre.

Edited by Ethos
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I answered your question a long time ago, Raor. Ethos just answered it again.

 

I'm still convinced hip-hop and rap only translates well onto albums. The ones with live performances always come across as messy, the live bands I've been seeing hardly contribute anything to the constant indecipherable barrage of vocals by one or two boisterous guys tromping around on stage. I've got a question, has any live hip-hop/rap performance ever evoked any level of emotion from any of you?

 

I've got a more important question: how many live hiphop acts have you seen? I mean actually there, not youtube or TV.

 

I average about 20 concerts a year (since about 2004). Some hiphop, some other stuff, sometimes dance (bellydancing, ballet, folk dancing, cirque du soleil, that sort of thing). The top 3 concerts I've been to were Nine Inch Nails at the Colisseum for the Lights in the Sky Tour, Jay-Z for the Heart of the City Tour, and of Montreal for the Hissing Fauna Tour. Just about every show I've been to has evoked some level of emotion, whether it was happiness or being super amped up, or wanting to kill everyone in the band for wasting my time and stealing my money.

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I was going to go see MURS in Austin but I had a final the next day so I had to miss it. I wanted to go see the Watch the Throne show in Houston this month but tickets were way out of my price range. The closest I've come to a rap/hip-hop show was seeing Matisyahu before 311, hahaha. That's disappointing but it was a good show.

 

I mostly blame not going to rap shows because I only got into rap a few years ago. I held similar opinions to raor and harmon because all I ever heard played was shit rap. Mike got me into good hip-hop. Started out with stuff like Mos Def and Common and the Roots, then moved to Kanye and Jay-Z. Now I listen to a lot of different artists that I would never have imagined listening to 4 years ago. KRS-ONE, Rakim, Dead Prez, MURS, Nas, Shad, etc.

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Nine Inch Nails was one of the only bands I've seen live, it was during the With Teeth tour so I guess that sets the bar for me pretty high.

 

Here's a hip-hop/rap song that I thought was pretty good when I was younger, the way he rapped with the music and beat meshed very well, but mostly I really liked the background music, only now I know that he didn't come up with it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHHT7dTmw8U

 

Also this song. I thought it set a strong vibe and atmosphere.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Ww-TQUeA3E

 

I haven't heard any rap songs that sound like this in a long time.

Edited by Nomrah
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I have a hard time picking off of Black On Both Sides, after Umi Says. I think it might be New World Water but I'm not sure. That album is just too good!

 

Tribe doin' what tribe do...talking about whatever they want and sound fantastic in the process:

 

From Jay-Z's concept album, American Gangster, inspired after he was shown a private screening of the film:

 

Rakim's thoughts on the Gulf War:

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tech nine is still doing his thing,yeah. He's not quite as popular in the mainstream but I think he's still pretty active, like still releasing an album every year I wanna say? He's prolly just enjoying making music and stuff instead of pushing for mass market appeal. Different strokes for different folks.
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