Call of Duty: Black Ops

[Wong]

You should post it on YouTube. I already shared two videos. It is easy as heck to do. The limit is 30 seconds though.

[Lenin]

The thing fails hard. I render the clip to spread the awesome and the thing just gives up at a random point no matter what. But I will not give up.

[Wong]

The only times I failed was when I tried to squeeze in the full 30 seconds. Try 28 seconds. It seems to be the magic number. Otherwise, it smooth sailing.

[Lenin]

It was a 24 second clip. Took 26 attempts but I finally got it to render.

 

From first game using a sniper rifle in multiplayer.

 

In reality, the PSG1's muzzle velocity is in the range of about 2,800~ feet per second. The in-game muzzle velocity of this gun, however, is Event Horizon.

 

I have zero explanation. And before anyone says anything, the title is a joke.

Edited December 29, 2010 by Lenin

[Mom]

The game was horribly out of sync due to lots of lag. What else is new.

[Lenin]

Would've gotten pretty bad sales if they played to truth and called it Lag Of Duty: Bullshit Ops. But you need to start appreciating the EventHorizonx51mm NATO round, TM.

 

It'll get better... maybe. The key here is to not talk at Treyarch like "PATCH THIS PATCH THAT LOL", the idea we should all have is to just start goddamn screaming in unison for dedicated console servers. I wouldn't hold your breath over it, but if there was ever a shot for this series getting dedicated servers on consoles, it'd be with Treyarch.

 

Fuck, as far as I'm concerned, I goddamn pay for my online gaming, I should have dedicated servers by default.

[Mom]

Treyarch doesn't pay for the dedicated servers, they just get payed by sony-usa, activision or whoever to develop the game. Activision is responsible for hosting servers (which they already do, but only lobby servers) so they'd be the ones to blame for not having servers-- and they havn't done so since cod4.

 

I too wish they had dedicated servers for the cod series, but the sad reality is that it's too popular to do so. We've all also been shot when we've already been a second or two seconds behind cover through all of the cod games. It just goes to show you every game in the series tends to get extremely out of sync at times, and the latency compensation can't be right 100% of the time. I only guess people have amplified their bullshit-meters in black ops because it has theater mode which shows you the game as if everybody were on sync with the host-- in which case it also shows the latency compensation in the works.

[Fukei]

The only times I've had bad hit detection issues is when the game first came out, then just recently after Christmas when 700,000 people have been online and clogging the servers. So I'm doing what Raor is doing and staying away from the game for a while. I'd go back to CoD4 too, but when I tried that the other day, I found 7 different lobbies in a row that were hacked. MW2 was the same last I checked.

[Rachis]

Owen I like how you just try to play this all off like it's ok. Yeah I agree the series is immensely popular and that dedicated servers will be a stretch, but our so called "bullshit-meters" aren't up because of the theater mode. The only reason you should have for going into theater mode because of bullshit is because you already knew something stupid happened. Our "bullshit-meters" are amped because we are dealing with similar issues to the previous cod games with the added twist of having to deal with the least accurate weapons in a long time if not ever. The recoil is ridiculous. I never played WaW so I can't really comment on any issues with the engine itself. All I know is this game feels like it's on cod4 level of difficulty to kill at range sometimes for less effort spent than you had to in cod4 to get the same kills. Having your weapons with terribad recoil is quite a bit more annoying than having to manage weapon sway and this also contributes to more occurances that raise the "bullshit-meter" when you dump into a guy and wonder why he took you out. Oh well the answer tends to be because you got unfavorable recoil that time instead of your aim actually being off. Big difference between cod4 and black ops. I refuse to make these comparisons with MW2 because recoil didn't play nearly as big a part.

 

So my conclusion ultimately is IW makes higher quality games while Treyarch is better at balancing. Either way having just one is pretty fucking unacceptable for how popular the series is. I feel like these games aren't complete.

[Mom]

I'm just extrapolating what I've gathered from other instances on gamefaqs when I used to frequent it, and the comments people put even on my own youtube videos. People in general have used theater mode is examples to fuel their arguments for Black Ops somehow magically having worse lag or hit-detection problems than other cod games-- particularly mw2. The same might not be true for the few people who post on acu, but it is true for a good chunk of people elsewhere, and I'm frankly sick of it.

 

I enjoy the higher recoil in general. Mw2 guns had no recoil at all. Realistic or not, I think it does the gun balancing thing more justice, but Treyarch needs to make the key tweaking of putting the 937rpm smgs at 35/20 instead of 30/20.

[Wong]

No. Then the 40/20 SMG will be obsolete and the Spectre and MPL will dominate. What they should do is make MP5/74u damage to 40/17 and FAMAS/AUG damage to 40/20.

[Bakuhatsu Pengin]

35 is the same as 40, only you get a free RF attachment with less recoil

id rather they just lower the famas and aug and other 937 to around hte same level, since 750 is generally around the same level.

 

they should lower aug and famas recoil while lowering the damage to 30/20

 

and then maybe give 20 round smgs a free built-in warlord

[Shirtless Crackhead]

Nobody better fuck with my CoD4 MP5.

[Mom]

No. Then the 40/20 SMG will be obsolete and the Spectre and MPL will dominate.

 

If that were true then the famas and aug would make ak47, galil and commando obsolete. The 3 shot kill would ensure the few 20 round 937rpm smgs get as much love as ak74u, spectre and mpl. Ak74u will still get love because it has access to grip and pro-pipe still. MP5k I don't know as much-- perhaps something can be done with it.

 

What they should do is make MP5/74u damage to 40/17 and FAMAS/AUG damage to 40/20.

 

Why would you want to turn the famas and aug into more of an smg than they already are? I think a 40/20 937rpm assault rifle would make all the smgs obsolete. (As it stands I already feel the famas and aug make all smgs obsolete-- even rapid fire ak74u)

 

 

they should lower aug and famas recoil while lowering the damage to 30/20

 

I could see something like that. As it stands I think black ops lacks one of those no-recoil weapons like ACR in mw2 and M4 in cod4.

Edited December 30, 2010 by TMRaven

[Wong]

35 is the same as 40

Kinda true. The 40 will makes it possible to still maintain a 3SK against the weakest of materials. Small technicality.

 

If that were true then the famas and aug would make ak47, galil and commando obsolete. The 3 shot kill would ensure the few 20 round 937rpm smgs get as much love as ak74u, spectre and mpl. Ak74u will still get love because it has access to grip and pro-pipe still. MP5k I don't know as much-- perhaps something can be done with it.

In MLG and GB, it is all about the 74u and Famas, and sometimes the G11 and Stoner.

 

I think a 40/20 937rpm assault rifle would make all the smgs obsolete.

You do realize that the Famas and AUG has a base damage 35/25 right? This means 3SK short range, 4SK long range. I want it 3SK short range, 5SK long range.

 

they should lower aug and famas recoil while lowering the damage to 30/20

Sounds good. I do not mind using the COD4 M4 again.

Edited December 30, 2010 by Wong

[Shirtless Crackhead]

I mean really, Black Ops answered the question, does CoD4 w/o Stopping Power work, the resounding answer is yes.

 

The general consensus is that CoD4 is still the best in the series, I don't see why somebody doesn't notice that.

 

I actually wouldn't mind Double Tap as a pseudo-Stopping Power because you'd pay for it by faster ammo use and more recoil, make it compete with SoH and Bling, maybe Overkill and something else; voila 2nd tier perks.

 

I'm against the pro perk thing, it's giving everyone like 6 perks, let's tone it back and cut the fat; as it where.

 

Particularly the Faster ADS, and SA Pro, both kinda bad ideas IMO; that's what the specific delays for the different weapons are fore, the SMG's and shotguns should be fast from standing/running, the AR's should be fast standing, basically; a simple way to give SMG's an advantage in a world where AR's are the damage/range kings (ala CoD4 engine, sans SP and Jugg).

Edited December 30, 2010 by DangerWorldWide

[Mom]

You do realize that the Famas and AUG has a base damage 35/25 right? This means 3SK short range, 4SK long range. I want it 3SK short range, 5SK long range.

 

You're basically making them rapid fire ak74us with no need for rapid fire attachment. Those two guns already have an advantage on ak74u as it is when in close range. Giving them 40 damage means they can kill just as fast as a rapid fire ak74u when the opponent is already damaged or you headshot them. They also then have the same advantage as the 40 damage assault rifles in that regards as well (meaning they're 2 shots when the opponent is already damaged or if you headshot) You might as well then make those guns into smgs I feel.

 

As it stands I feel the best way to make those 20 round 937rpm smgs even have a chance in the game is making them a 3 shot kill. It shouldn't make them dominant over the ak74u or mp5k, because the same isn't exactly true with the assault rifles. You see just as much commando, galil and ak47 as the famas and aug. In fact you'd see way more if they weren't unlocked so late in a prestige.

 

I think the reason you don't see as much of the 40 damage assault rifles on mlg and gamebattles is because the games aren't as big, and their advantages of better crowd control and faster killing when fighting damaged opponents is less common.

[Rachis]

How does introducing luck make balancing better?

 

Making the 937 rpm smg's 35/20 completely destroys the concept of the Ak74u and MP5K being the damage dealers. They all become 3 shots. Great balance.

[Wong]

You're basically making them rapid fire ak74us with no need for rapid fire attachment.

It already is, except with 95% run speed, higher hip spread, and longer ADS time.

 

They also then have the same advantage as the 40 damage assault rifles in that regards as well (meaning they're 2 shots when the opponent is already damaged or if you headshot) You might as well then make those guns into smgs I feel.

The Famas and AUG will also only take two shots if opponent is already damaged.

 

As far as head shots goes:

 

35 damage:

- No head shots: 35 * 3 = 105 (3SK)

- One head shot: 35 * 1.4 + 35 = 84 (fail, 3SK required)

- Two head shots: 35 * 1.4 * 2 = 98 (fail, 3SK required)

 

40 damage:

- No head shots: 40 * 3 = 120 (3SK)

- One head shot: 40 * 1.4 + 40 = 96 (fail, 3SK required)

- Two head shots: 40 * 1.4 * 2 = 112 (win, only 2SK required)

 

As you can see, the only real difference between the two is that the 40 will win if you get two consecutive headshots.

 

I mean really, Black Ops answered the question, does CoD4 w/o Stopping Power work, the resounding answer is yes.

Except that the Famas/AUG is basically the M4 with SP, higher ROF, and slightly more recoil.

Now I rethink about it, one of the reasons why the P90 was such a great weapon was due to its high ammo cap. If all the 30/20 SMGs gets an ammo cap boost, I think they will be good.

But yes, the CoD series does not need SP. I do agree that the sniper rifles should get a free SP, which the game did.

 

The general consensus is that CoD4 is still the best in the series, I don't see why somebody doesn't notice that.

Okay, I agree. It was my favorite, disregarding some flaws, but what's the point?

 

I actually wouldn't mind Double Tap as a pseudo-Stopping Power because you'd pay for it by faster ammo use and more recoil, make it compete with SoH and Bling, maybe Overkill and something else; voila 2nd tier perks.

Well, Rapid Fire is the new Double Tap, so TA might just take that out. But I do not mind the reintroduction of Double Tap.

 

I'm against the pro perk thing, it's giving everyone like 6 perks, let's tone it back and cut the fat; as it where.

That, and the grinding experience for those who does prestige is annoying.

 

-------------------------

 

However, if there is anything that TA (or Respawn Entertainment) should reintroduce from the CoD series, it will be the stock bash from CoD2 and remove knives. Two hits to the front or one hit from the back. None of this panic knife BS. Maybe the only exception is if they have the Tomahawk or Throwing Knife as there lethal "grenade".

Edited December 30, 2010 by Wong

[Shirtless Crackhead]

Yeah accept the FAMAS has higher damage and ROF than the CoD4 M4.

 

Play CoD4 w/o Juggernaut or Stopping power.

[Bakuhatsu Pengin]

respawn entertainment is a horrible company name

 

just thought id say that

[Mom]

How does introducing luck make balancing better?

 

Making the 937 rpm smg's 35/20 completely destroys the concept of the Ak74u and MP5K being the damage dealers. They all become 3 shots. Great balance.

 

Do the famas and aug destroy the concept of the ak47 being a damage dealer? No. That gun still tears through people and groups like no other. The concept works with the assault rifles in black ops, so I don't see why it wouldn't work for smgs in black ops.

 

You see 5 assault rifles being used very prominently, but you only see one smg being used. You could even give a bit more recoil on the 30+ round mag smgs like mpl and spectre to compensate for the higher damage potential, but if you don't do anything to strengthen the smgs besides ak74u, nobody will ever use them. Strengthening the aug and famas to be super-pseudo smgs is definitely not the answer to that. Making the aug and famas 5 shot kill at range instead of 4 won't change much either. From my personal experience with famas, I can only kill with it at range using burst shots. The thing shoots fast enough that your second burst will always get at least 2-3 shots out anyways. Changing from 4-5 still means you gotta 2 burst people at range to kill them.

Edited December 30, 2010 by TMRaven

[Rachis]

Fixing an assault rifle class that is very well balanced to itself to make another class of weapons work better is not the answer. Smg's need to get fixed and I don't have the time right now to thoroughly go through it. Maybe later.

 

Owen, competitive gameplay is all about being able to do the same things as everyone else faster than they can do it. Famas is predictable with the fastest rof. AK74u gives people a mobility advantage without losing the 3 shot kill. That's speed.

 

[edit]: And thanks Owen for completely taking my statement out of context. The fact that the AK47 can kill people well has absolutely nothing to do with the recoil issue I was talking about and you didn't even have the good sense to talk about the same weapons. The 750 rpm assault rifles are easier to use than the 937 rpm assault rifles when it comes to being an assault rifle. That's obviously why you see Famas/Aug a lot up close, but ultimately those two weapons have a greater killing ability than the other rifles. It's a part of what makes the assault rifle balance as good as it is even though I disagree with it being because one thing is easier to use than another.

 

It's nice that you completely avoided the fact that you suggested all smg's be 3 shot kill weapons.

Edited December 30, 2010 by Wrenchis

[Wong]

I just have one question for you, Owen. How does strengthening the aug and famas base damage of 35 to 40 make it a super-pseudo smg, and with that logic, how it is not already a super-pseudo smg with a base damage of 35.

 

I will read and reply this thread tomorrow. I have to wake up in five hours for work. Night.

 

Edit:

Also, I just randomly chose to make the damage of the 937's 40/20 out of the whim. My point was not about the max damage, it was about the min. Heck, I could have made it 35/20.

Edited December 30, 2010 by Wong

[Mom]

Then I have nothing else to say to you. Come back when you have ideas.

 

I never avoided the fact that I suggested all smgs be 3shot kill weapons. I welcome the idea and I still stand by it.

 

 

Edit for wong:

 

I already believe the famas and aurg are pseudo smgs-- and damn good ones at that. But in the current state of the game, their only competition in cqc is the ak74u, and not even rapid fire ak74u completely trumps them because of their already high rate of fire. The one thing the rapid fire ak74u has over the famas and aug is that 40 shot damage-- which ends up for faster kills with headshots or already damaged situations, but that advantage is completely nullified with a 40/20 famas and aug. The famas and aug already dont' need a rapid fire attachment either, and they have a longer max damage range compared to the ak74u. Sure you could argue the tighter hip fire accuracy and 5% faster moving speed, but from my experience, the famas and aug's hip fire is already potent enough even without steady aim-- havn't really found a huge benefit of ak74u's hip fire over famas and aug. I already commented on your point of their potential minimum damage of 20, as it still doesn't change the speed of a 2 burst kill when at long ranges.

Edited December 30, 2010 by TMRaven